Why the wars are failures or will be failures anyway Tuesday, Nov 17 2009 

Why the wars are failures or will be failures

Some just refuse to understand this simple logical fact, or just damn evil to enforce it and make you believe that they are right and everybody else is wrong. Don't listen to them!

The biggest problem with the wars and interference is the incompatibility of “our” way with “their” way.

And there is more.

I’m sure of many thinks, that extremism, such as extremist religion and extremist state laws and human rights abuses plays a major role why would most Americans support the idea of “bringing democracy” to these countries.

The biggest problem is, that “our way” is not necessarily compatible and not just that, but “our way” might have become a lot worse, since our economy is the one crumbling, our human right laws are flawed and our jails are full of criminals. This is what they see from over there and of course they don’t want something similar, because they will just point the finger and say “Look, you tell us that it’s horrific to execute people and yet you do the same. You say, our protests were broken up by violent force of the police and yet you do the same (G20 protest). You tell us, that we are extreme, and yet you fill up the jails with people. You tell us that our religion is violent, and yet yours aren’t far, since you are the ones who bomb and imprison innocent people who got nothing to do with world affairs. ”

So what I’m trying to say is…maybe “our way” of life is just as flawed (if not as much) and it is quite hypocritical to try to force such ideology and system to others who got something else.

The Star of David has already became the symbol of oppression, just like the Swastika in Europe

Also about the cultural, ideological, traditional differences. The reason of the violence regarding Israel and the rest is, basically just that. Israel tries (tried) to maintain a system which is based on western ideas and western style living in the middle of a place, where everything else is sharply different. Jordan has a king, Syria is the same, Iran is an Islamic Republic. This is why the Jewish state fails..because it’s too small of a boat in the sea of an entirely different culture, which developed differently but highly compatible to region itself and Israel sticks out as a sore thumb. And this is even a bigger issue, than whether or not Jewish religion differences versus Islam, since many Islamic countries still have quite large Jewish diaspora, even iran has over 60,000 Jews living there since Babylonian times. So it’s not really the question of religion or belief (Both Islam and Jewish are Abrahamic religions anyway so we aren’t talking about sharp differences like Christianity and Buddhism for example) .
The problem is, that after WWII, the Jews who left Europe and formed a state, they brought the European style ideology and used force to gain enough power and land and tried to exist. Unfortunately those Jews who started this, are really not compatible to the region, since they are more Euro

Not all Jews are Zionists

Zionism is Nationalism, but not all Jews are Zionists

pean than Middle-Eastern, save the original population who lived there already.

So anyway, that’s just an example, of how different traditions and governmental-political-ideological systems can be completely incompatible and forcefully trying to change a state or a country will incite bloodshed and hate, no matter what.

Jews in Iran. Jewish religion is NOT alien in the Middle-East

The Middle-East is a hard nutshell to crack..and while we can keep sending thousands upon thousands of troops, it will make a little or no difference. The Afghanistan war or the Iraq war are like a milk drop into a coffee. You try to change the coffee color to milky-coffee but 2-3 drops will just disappear in the whole cup without making any differences. That’s why even if Iraq has a puppet president who support western ideas and even if the Afghan war would be won and a new Honest (not Karzai) president would be sitting there, It might not last long, due to the incredible force of thousands of years of traditions and cultural values and they might just sweep it out within years and everything goes back to what it was or something close to it.

-Well, don’t take that the wrong way, I’m not trying to reference it anyway to skin color or ethnicity, i’m just trying to find a metaphorical example.

So how to change them?

Well, how about by an example of ourselves instead of wars?  How about showing our greatness of leading in technology and social + ideological reforms necessary and not run endlessly in the mouse wheel of stillness?


Ideas and ways of life that transforms the world and make others change their ways and ideologies towards the better. These are ideas worth spreading

If USA (or EU) want others to change, you aren’t supposed to be using force, because then that becomes the example itself. What we gotta do is to show an example of non-aggression and work on our own problems and work out or own problems and try to leap forward from this staleness and violent behavior.
I can almost guarantee you, that good example without violent interference will definitely make others to follow much quicker than forcing them to swallow a pill, that we wouldn’t even swallow either.


Hungary’s Panic-Stricken Dictatorship Clashed With Protestors Monday, Mar 17 2008 

Tensions were already running high as the 160th anniversary of the 1848 revolution on the 15th March approached. The police had already cordoned off Kossuth Square and more than 2000 riot police were deployed around the parliament days before the anniversary.

Mathaba — A few hundred protesters turned up at Kossuth Square, in the centre of Budapest, where the official commemorations were about to start with the ceremonial raising the Republic’s flag attended by President Solyom and Hungary’s PM Gyurcsany, on Saturday morning 9am.

The demonstrators were outside the previously cordoned off area and shouting “Gyurcsany, f.ck off!” Heavy police presence can be seen at the Square.

By 10.15 a.m. 1,500 to 2,000 anti-government demonstrators were marching towards the official government celebrations at the National Museum. The crowd was led by Reverend Jnr. Hegedus after a memorial had been held at Szabadsag (Freedom) Square. The crowd was shouting anti-government slogans. Israeli-connected IN-KAL, the security for the official government celebrations confirmed that they would “remove anyone who is protesting against PM Gyurcsany”.

At 11.15 a.m. there are only a handful of people at the official government commemoration at the National Museum. Observers noticed that there were no flags – no official government speeches and certainly no speech from PM Gyurcsany.

Five minutes later the 2,000 strong anti-government crowd had reached their next stop at Fovamhaz Square. There was no confrontation at that time, with the few dozen people at the official celebration nor with the few thousand police guarding them.

Fifteen minutes later, at 11.35 a.m. local Hungarian time, 2 bigger units of the Hungarian Guard left Fovamhaz Square and were marching through Vaci street in formation, with enthusiastic citizens shouting “Go on, Guard!”. The Hungarian Guard joined Reverend Jnr. Hegedus’ memorial at Szabadsag Square in the morning and assisted to remove the red paint from the sculpture of Hungarian novelist and legend Albert Wass that had been vandalised some week earlier.

20 minutes later at 11.55 a.m. Reverend Hegedus asked the crowd at Fovamhaz Square: “Where has Petofi’s revolution faded? Where are the ideas that once represented the 1848 revolution?” “The liar government and their allies befoul the very steps where Petofi recited the 12 points” he added. Hegedus urged national organisations and parties to cooperate together. He also had a message to Simon Peres, the Israeli President, who months ago announced that “Israel is buying up Hungary”: “Petofi would say: “Occupy your wh_re mother, not our country!”.

An hour later at 12.55 p.m, more than 1,500 anti-government demonstrators arrived at 15 March Square, where the Liberal SZDSZ party member Demszky, Budapest’s Mayor tried to make a speech. He was guarded by hundreds of police and IN-KAL security guards fearing that last year’s incidents would be repeated when demonstrators threw eggs at the Mayor. Police cordoned off the area so demonstrators were outside the “throwing zone”. Nevertheless, they do their best by throwing eggs, tomatoes etc, shouting “To prison!” and “Treason!”.

Reuters reported clashes between demonstrators and the police, saying they responded to the egg throwing with tear gas rounds. A police spokesman said that 21 people were arrested in minor clashes throughout the day and that three police had been lightly injured. — Mathaba

From Here.